Hi Mike - no problem raising this issue again (you and others should do this) - more of a problem is my terrible typing - I was writing this whilst on the phone. I am sure that others will add to this debate. I am sure people will not agree with me. However, the key issue is informed discussion. Not blind acceptance. This happens with taxonomy all the time. For example I am in the throes of submitting a paper that splits our Kunzea into 10 endemic species. I am sure that will also cause debate and detraction. I expect that - but I am still doing my job putting out my ideas - remember formally recognised taxa are by and large merely hypotheses, ideas that need further testing to become established facts. The lumping of Hebe into Veronica is an idea, it just needs further testing. Have a good day. Peter